I really love this perspective, Matt, and greatly appreciate you taking the deeper dive. Particularly thankful for sharing Kira's substack as well (Every member of any company's C-Suite would greatly benefit from this understanding of investing in Brand/Growth).
It’s challenging to fully represent one’s thoughts on this subject in a short segment of a podcast. You and I are much more aligned than you might think. I completely agree on your POV regarding the difference between being entertained vs. being sold. I do, however, believe that there are very subtle ways in which you can integrate product attributes authentically that can have resounding impact.
When you have a remarkable team of athletes, great branded content, have been in the marketplace for over a decade and you’re still fighting for the 6th, 7th or 8th spot for shelf space in run specialty’s largest market, you might need to insert a small sliver of a reference to the product that is helping to place your team on podiums to give your brand the added boost it needs.
I’d never suggest a full-on infomercial dropped into an emotional brand piece. Just something that can subtly sit in the back of the viewer’s mind as they spend 50 minutes with you watching your athletes run one of the most prestigious ultras in the world.
Strategically, I agree with letting long-form, emotionally driven content stand-alone and cutting product-focused take-downs that can be used to support your growth/performance objectives. But only if your distribution strategy for that content is well-resourced. Otherwise It won’t have the redundancy it needs to make an impact amongst the noise of an increasingly crowded marketplace.
One of the points I was intending to reference but didn’t directly state during the podcast was the specific lack in the Outdoor industry of utilizing professional athletes within product marketing. Traditional stick and ball sports do this much better than Outdoor does and we can all learn from it and improve upon it more authentically.
Thanks again for the deeper dive, Matt, love this!
I absolutely ran with what was a brief comment of yours 😂 I love that Lutze and DBo always get me thinking! I have notes in my head just about every time but am usually running and forget half of them!
I of course am not implying product marketing consists of a full infomercial mid-film. However, I still don’t think the subtle mention is necessary either. We see the product no less than 100 times. I want to let the branding piece do its thing. That’s the long-term win. The strong emotional connection is as strong or stronger than any podium reference IMO. There’s more differentiable meaning.
An honest question for anyone selling to wholesale - does a wholesale buyer purchase more of X brand product because it was on the podium at a major race?
If the distribution strategy is not resourced I’m still sticking with the emotional route and skipping the rational cutdowns altogether. I think I sourced it enough but the emotional angle goes furthest in the long run. Others may see it different but that’s how I’d proceed. Love this discussion.
I tell Lutze and Dbo the same thing after every pod (taking mental notes, talking out loud to them) but am too either on the trails, on the bike or in the car and my "notes" are only as good as my memory.
Your sources for the emotional angle were thorough. And as a brand marketer and storyteller, I've spent much of my career in the "emotional space". That said, I think we can still healthfully and fundamentally disagree regarding to subtly mention or to not subtly mention.
My argument for it is largely based on the fact that every single trail running brand in the space has emotionally-led content. That is without exception. Several of them have very similar athlete teams. And the space is getting increasingly more crowded. If product IS your strong differentiator, it might help to showcase it every so slightly, even in your brand marketing.
True, we did see the Terrex product no less than 100 in the film. To the casually interested trail runner, I would all but guarantee that not one of them knows the name of the shoe. This is the loss, in my eyes. All too often brands create content solely for us super fans who know all of the athletes and watch all of the product reviews. In that echo chamber, we're alienating a lot of new potential customers.
The strength of Terrex' film, in my eyes, was that it capture the spirt of States better than almost anyone I've ever seen and they took an individual sport and truly made it feel like a team sport. Those takeaways alone are enough to justify the film and let it stand on its own. All I'm adding is that it doesn't hurt to find subtle and authentic ways to bring casually interested viewer a bit closer to the product.
I really love this perspective, Matt, and greatly appreciate you taking the deeper dive. Particularly thankful for sharing Kira's substack as well (Every member of any company's C-Suite would greatly benefit from this understanding of investing in Brand/Growth).
It’s challenging to fully represent one’s thoughts on this subject in a short segment of a podcast. You and I are much more aligned than you might think. I completely agree on your POV regarding the difference between being entertained vs. being sold. I do, however, believe that there are very subtle ways in which you can integrate product attributes authentically that can have resounding impact.
When you have a remarkable team of athletes, great branded content, have been in the marketplace for over a decade and you’re still fighting for the 6th, 7th or 8th spot for shelf space in run specialty’s largest market, you might need to insert a small sliver of a reference to the product that is helping to place your team on podiums to give your brand the added boost it needs.
I’d never suggest a full-on infomercial dropped into an emotional brand piece. Just something that can subtly sit in the back of the viewer’s mind as they spend 50 minutes with you watching your athletes run one of the most prestigious ultras in the world.
Strategically, I agree with letting long-form, emotionally driven content stand-alone and cutting product-focused take-downs that can be used to support your growth/performance objectives. But only if your distribution strategy for that content is well-resourced. Otherwise It won’t have the redundancy it needs to make an impact amongst the noise of an increasingly crowded marketplace.
One of the points I was intending to reference but didn’t directly state during the podcast was the specific lack in the Outdoor industry of utilizing professional athletes within product marketing. Traditional stick and ball sports do this much better than Outdoor does and we can all learn from it and improve upon it more authentically.
Thanks again for the deeper dive, Matt, love this!
I absolutely ran with what was a brief comment of yours 😂 I love that Lutze and DBo always get me thinking! I have notes in my head just about every time but am usually running and forget half of them!
I of course am not implying product marketing consists of a full infomercial mid-film. However, I still don’t think the subtle mention is necessary either. We see the product no less than 100 times. I want to let the branding piece do its thing. That’s the long-term win. The strong emotional connection is as strong or stronger than any podium reference IMO. There’s more differentiable meaning.
An honest question for anyone selling to wholesale - does a wholesale buyer purchase more of X brand product because it was on the podium at a major race?
If the distribution strategy is not resourced I’m still sticking with the emotional route and skipping the rational cutdowns altogether. I think I sourced it enough but the emotional angle goes furthest in the long run. Others may see it different but that’s how I’d proceed. Love this discussion.
I tell Lutze and Dbo the same thing after every pod (taking mental notes, talking out loud to them) but am too either on the trails, on the bike or in the car and my "notes" are only as good as my memory.
Your sources for the emotional angle were thorough. And as a brand marketer and storyteller, I've spent much of my career in the "emotional space". That said, I think we can still healthfully and fundamentally disagree regarding to subtly mention or to not subtly mention.
My argument for it is largely based on the fact that every single trail running brand in the space has emotionally-led content. That is without exception. Several of them have very similar athlete teams. And the space is getting increasingly more crowded. If product IS your strong differentiator, it might help to showcase it every so slightly, even in your brand marketing.
True, we did see the Terrex product no less than 100 in the film. To the casually interested trail runner, I would all but guarantee that not one of them knows the name of the shoe. This is the loss, in my eyes. All too often brands create content solely for us super fans who know all of the athletes and watch all of the product reviews. In that echo chamber, we're alienating a lot of new potential customers.
The strength of Terrex' film, in my eyes, was that it capture the spirt of States better than almost anyone I've ever seen and they took an individual sport and truly made it feel like a team sport. Those takeaways alone are enough to justify the film and let it stand on its own. All I'm adding is that it doesn't hurt to find subtle and authentic ways to bring casually interested viewer a bit closer to the product.